Debian 11 & php8
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@WLS-ITGuy said in Debian 11 & php8:
One of the applications we use just released a new version and the update requires php8.0 or above.
We're using Debian 11 and since 11.7 was just released, which doesn't have php8 in the release. I was wondering how do I find out when things like php. Mariadb, Apache, NGNIX, etc get applied to distros?
You are running debian stable which means that packages have stable versions.
So when Debain 11 was released with php version 7.4.x it will keep having that version forever. It will never become php 8.
It's because php8 is not 100% backward compatible with 7.x so if Debian would automatically upgrade to php8 then applications will break. That is not a stable approach.This goes for all packages, not just php. Updates will only be minor releases with bugfixes and security issues fixed.
Every 2 years or so you get a new Debian stable version and then you get newer versions of all 50,000+ packages as well.
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It might be of interest to know that Debian 12 tentative release date is June 10th.
Debian 12 uses PHP 8.2
You can always find the packages of every release here:
https://www.debian.org/distrib/packagesLook under "stable" packages for the current release and under "testing" for the next upcoming version of debian.
For example this is the upcoming php version in Debian 12 (aka bookworm):
https://packages.debian.org/bookworm/php -
@WLS-ITGuy said in Debian 11 & php8:
One of the applications we use just released a new version and the update requires php8.0 or above.
So right now the best approach is to wait until Debian 12 is released officially and then install Debian 12 with the new version of the application.
If the application is supported on Debian they have likely tested it with Debian 12. -
@Pete-S said in Debian 11 & php8:
So right now the best approach is to wait until Debian 12 is released officially and then install Debian 12 with the new version of the application.
Do exactly this.
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@WLS-ITGuy said in Debian 11 & php8:
One of the applications we use just released a new version and the update requires php8.0 or above.
We're using Debian 11 and since 11.7 was just released, which doesn't have php8 in the release. I was wondering how do I find out when things like php. Mariadb, Apache, NGNIX, etc get applied to distros?
If you want any kind of modernity, Debian isn't really for you OR you use Debian as a base and do not use it as your package testing and repo system - which is generally not advised in production, but it is an okay approach as long as you accept it. Basically it means you are using Debian as a base and assembling your own distro instead of trusting the vendors.
With my CIO hat on, we never do that. If we want modern software, and we normally do, we run Ubuntu or Fedora. Both of which have had PHP 8 and 8.1 (8.2 is current) for quite a long time. Debian is great as a base and when you want things that never change. But it is not good when you want things that are keeping up to date.
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@Pete-S said in Debian 11 & php8:
@WLS-ITGuy said in Debian 11 & php8:
One of the applications we use just released a new version and the update requires php8.0 or above.
So right now the best approach is to wait until Debian 12 is released officially and then install Debian 12 with the new version of the application.
If the application is supported on Debian they have likely tested it with Debian 12.I'd say the best approach is to not be on Debian. Debian is wonderful, but primarily as a base for building distos, running it as the core enterprise OS comes with problems and this highlights them. PHP 8.0 isn't new or current. It's a few versions behind. That means Debian as tested is out of date and less mature (software maturity comes from updating, not stagnation.) There's good reason to want distros that don't update and stay on LTS software, but those reasons are few and far between and should always be met with "why aren't you correcting the problems that led to wanting LTS?"
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Debian 12 "Bookworm" is, in theory, under a month away and is going to PHP 8.2. So that is very good. But the long release cycles are always going to be a challenge that there isn't really a reason for.
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See this site for instructions : https://php.watch/articles/install-php82-ubuntu-debian
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@IgnaceQ said in Debian 11 & php8:
See this site for instructions : https://php.watch/articles/install-php82-ubuntu-debian
Better to install Debian 12 right now instead.
It's extremely easy and when you run "apt update && apt upgrade" you get new packages.
When Debian 12 becomes the official "stable" version, so will your new install - without you having to do anything.You just pick it from here:
https://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/Most people will want this:
https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/bookworm_di_rc3/amd64/iso-cd/debian-bookworm-DI-rc3-amd64-netinst.iso -
@scottalanmiller said in Debian 11 & php8:
Debian 12 "Bookworm" is, in theory, under a month away and is going to PHP 8.2. So that is very good. But the long release cycles are always going to be a challenge that there isn't really a reason for.
Not a challenge at all but the reason to run "stable" is for stability. Meaning an update will never break your system and you get bug fixes and security updates. You won't get new features but you won't get new bugs that breaks your system either or changed functionality.
If you don't want or need that stability and favor new shiny things then you just install debian "testing". It's a rolling release.
Debian is not just one distro. Many companies run "testing" on workstations and "stable" on production servers.
There is a third option and that is Debian "unstable". Then you get new packages as soon as they are available. This is for the enthusiasts and debian developers primarily and not recommended for the general user that just wants something that works.
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@Pete-S said in Debian 11 & php8:
@scottalanmiller said in Debian 11 & php8:
Debian 12 "Bookworm" is, in theory, under a month away and is going to PHP 8.2. So that is very good. But the long release cycles are always going to be a challenge that there isn't really a reason for.
Not a challenge at all but the reason to run "stable" is for stability. Meaning an update will never break your system and you get bug fixes and security updates. You won't get new features but you won't get new bugs that breaks your system either or changed functionality.
If you don't want or need that stability and favor new shiny things then you just install debian "testing". It's a rolling release.
Debian is not just one distro. Many companies run "testing" on workstations and "stable" on production servers.
There is a third option and that is Debian "unstable". Then you get new packages as soon as they are available. This is for the enthusiasts and debian developers primarily and not recommended for the general user that just wants something that works.
And just run containers. Then new libs aren’t an issue. The host shouldn’t matter at this point, so run stable. Then run containerized workloads for the rest and they can stay up to date.
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@Pete-S said in Debian 11 & php8:
Not a challenge at all but the reason to run "stable" is for stability.
Once you start abandoning the integration, though, you are abandoning stability. The idea of using an LTS and then replacing the parts of the OS that aren't up to date is counterproductive. Choose the most up to date, best supported, most stable version and use the fully tested and integrated components instead.
The idea of "stable" is not stability in IT terms, that's a myth. It's actually against that. The idea of current is for IT stability. Stable, in reference to an OS like this, is in reference to the versions of products remaining stable so that unsupported, out of date software from bad vendors can be used without updating for long periods of time. Not a positive stable, it's a bad stable.
